Founding member of RIG here, from back in the good old days...98-00, converting from the JB singers into a real show choir... I heard through the grapevine that you guys won a competition and I had to come see if it was true. Good work guys, glad things are getting back on track over at Kennedy! Maybe Ill try to sneak out to see you guys at some point
i actually like the raw score idea...its much more clear cut on what the groups excelled in and what they didnt do so hot on. plus it helps the group prepare for the next competition. besides the fact that their could be ties...i would rather have a scoring rather than ranking system in finals
I think I like points converted to rankings.
I don't like when all judges have to do is write down the final order they want- although, every judge I know keeps track of their scores anyway (not to say the reason judges keep track of their scores is simply to control the outcome of the competition- most do it to stay consistent with themselves and to make sure they're being fair to earlier groups by not underscoring them simply because they're earlier in the schedule- if a group at 11am sets a high standard for a judge, they have to be able to score later groups accordingly). I think that scoring finals as opposed to ranking at least encourages judges to go on more than just the show they like the best, or the show they are most entertained by.
I also like that when scores get converted to rankings, it makes each judge's opinion worth the same amount as every other judge on the panel- one judge can't affect the entire outcome of the competition. If one judge has Group B like, 26 points behind Group A, and most other judges don't have a gap as large as that, converting to rankings will even out that gap while still acknowledging the judge's wish to have group A scored higher than group B.
I don't know... I think each system has good and bad aspects.
i actually like the raw score idea...its much more clear cut on what the groups excelled in and what they didnt do so hot on. plus it helps the group prepare for the next competition. besides the fact that their could be ties...i would rather have a scoring rather than ranking system in finals
OK not wanting to cause any controversy here, but thought it might be interesting to see what the results would have been if scores were converted to rankings and then points. As stated many times before there is no perfect scoring system. Every comp does it differently and everyone knows the rules going in. We all run into these varied scoring systems throughout the season and sometimes it works in our favor and sometimes not. Regardless, we have to follow the scoring rules.
As a director who runs a competition, I can tell you that there is nothing that keeps me awake more at night than the scoring system. Directors spend countless hours trying to come up with a system that is fair for all and that portrays the results in a manner that represents the entire judging panel. We have to trust our judges and respect their opinions.
Just my 2 cents worth.
I can't wait to see Totino, Hastings and Kennedy this weekend.
Ranking system converted to points
First 21 Points
Second 19 Points
Third 16 Points
Fourth 14 Points
Fifth 11 Points
Sixth 9 Points
I pulled this right off of our Finals score sheet.
OK not wanting to cause any controversy here, but thought it might be interesting to see what the results would have been if scores were converted to rankings and then points. As stated many times before there is no perfect scoring system. Every comp does it differently and everyone knows the rules going in. We all run into these varied scoring systems throughout the season and sometimes it works in our favor and sometimes not. Regardless, we have to follow the scoring rules.
As a director who runs a competition, I can tell you that there is nothing that keeps me awake more at night than the scoring system. Directors spend countless hours trying to come up with a system that is fair for all and that portrays the results in a manner that represents the entire judging panel. We have to trust our judges and respect their opinions.
Just my 2 cents worth.
I can't wait to see Totino, Hastings and Kennedy this weekend.
Ranking system converted to points
First 21 Points
Second 19 Points
Third 16 Points
Fourth 14 Points
Fifth 11 Points
Sixth 9 Points
fyi rossschulz, we wanted to be there much earlier to watch and support other groups, but unfortunately our equpiment truck broke down, so we waited for two hours before we could leave for eau claire... just thought i'd let you know
-Tom
Yeah, well, Eaglettes is our *bottom* prep group (although we don't show them or Eagle nearly enough love...WE LOVE YOU PREPPIES!). I always think our school is weird though for having our show choirs' names be some variation of our mascot - I mean, are there any "Dancing Blue Devils" or God forbid "Fighting Terriers Show Choir"? No, there aren't.
haha, then Mayville is as weird as Eau Claire if it makes you feel any better, seeing as they have the 'Cardinal' in their name.
Yeah, well, Eaglettes is our *bottom* prep group (although we don't show them or Eagle nearly enough love...WE LOVE YOU PREPPIES!). I always think our school is weird though for having our show choirs' names be some variation of our mascot - I mean, are there any "Dancing Blue Devils" or God forbid "Fighting Terriers Show Choir"? No, there aren't.
COOL! Yeah...to do that for our girls group, it'd be 9 people...and though we love 'em eaglettes don't exactly clean up in the prep division like divaz do. (Notice I spelled Divaz with a Z!)
QUOTE(ItsABeautifulDay @ Feb 5 2007, 08:20 PM) 380841
i thought East Side Swingers would be in top 3 for prep groups...otherwise no major surprises...
I was shocked ESS didn't get in the top three...I don't get it " border="0" alt="blink.gif" /> But the Divaz did a great job! I didn't sharpie an E onto my chest for nothing...
QUOTE(Wisconsiniteshow choirite @ Feb 5 2007, 04:39 PM) 380804
Says the guy saying judges should be fired for disagreeing.
He said a lot of nice things too. I didn't really interpret the rest of what he said as mean though.
I said mothing about him being fired, I don't really care about judges cause I know judges are like that in general.
I personally thought his Bio was very funny to read.
The first part of his post, good. That other part, not so great.
The biggest thing of his whole comment about "heart" really pissed me off.
We use Charter buses to every out of town competition we go to. It's not that our school is "rich" because that's far from the point. We fund raise almost all of the money we use throughout our season. And I really don't think the size of one's bus is any determining factor in the "deserved" placing of a group.
As far as the "winning is everything" comment. That is a very ignorant view on the issue. If winning was everything, what would be the point of competition when 5/6 of the group that compete in finals won't win. A perk of competition is winning yes, but the drive comes from the feeling you get when you're on stage. To hear friends, family, and fans cheer your name and chant "GCS" (speaking from my experiences) makes the concept of performing so much more enjoyable and worthwhile.
I didn't see Kennedy's show because I wasn't there, but I'm sure the outcome was a fair one. And as far as winning goes..."all" groups don't cheer a lot when they win. Some directors/students find it tacky and unprofessional. I recently saw Ankeny compete this weekend and found that when they were announced Grand Champions, they applauded themselves...but they weren't insincere towards any other group or person that was there. They were proud of themselves, as they should have been I'm sure, but taking it to the extreme where your group is inconsiderate to other competitors or fans is crossing the line. You know this I'm sure.
I'm not saying your group was not deserving of your win because I'm sure you were. I'm also not attacking you, by insinuating that you are "bashing" anyone. I'm simply saying that some of the comments you made in your previous posts bothered me. Perhaps I'm taking it too personally but that is how I feel. Hopefully I will get the chance to watch Kennedy at Hastings and perhaps get to meet you randomly. I wish your group and band the best of luck.
i have been in the show choir family for years and i have always looked foreward to seeing Totino perform and have always assumed you were gonna win. My sister used to be in Jefferson Connestion, and Now i am in Bloomington Kennedy's Band Playing the drums. I was Very impressed with your show and had no idea how close we were going into the finals. To tell you the truth i did not belive it when i heard it but it happened, and i apologize for some of the non-classy behavor that was going on. I feel like both groups from kennedy have so much HEARt and Dedication to what they do, and cramming on to a little school bus for a 2 hour ride takes some heart and to wake up at 4 in the morning takes heart. Now i know there are other groups that get up earlier thatn that, but they do not do it with pride. I personally get jelous of you guys when you get to show up at noon and ride a big coach bus. But that is beside the piont. When someone like kennedy wins, we are going to go nuts because when was the last time you remeber us winning any competitions???winning is everything, and everyone in this group should be able to let it all out, because our bus is too small to party in.
QUOTE(rossschulz @ Feb 5 2007, 03:47 PM) 380773
here is what goes down in the show choir world.
When you win
You Cheer A Lot.
And you don't think that they woke up early? And you really think the kids have a choice of what they ride in, their director sets up what they ride in, and the choose the charter bus. And for them walking there at noon, they don't have a prep group to get there early in the morning and if they are scheduled later in the day they can afford to do that.
I would highly recomend watching what you say on these boards.
Eau Claire Memorial Winterfest 2007
" border="0" alt="blink.gif" /> But the Divaz did a great job! I didn't sharpie an E onto my chest for nothing...
