[b][color=gray]To the director insinuating that Clover Hill got to eat at the restaurant that the rest of us didn't get to eat at, they made a group decision to go ahead and keep their plans there, and simply all paid out of pocket for it. Say what you want of the competition, but back the hell off of the kids. That's low.
[quote name='KEVDOUG' date='1302520136' post='523922']I agree that you do see schools model themselves after the few CA show choirs that we have seen live (i.e. Burbank, Burroughs, Hart, Los Al) but think of how all the choirs that have copied Clinton, Mt. Zion, Fairfield, and Marysville. The reason why people imitate them is because they are innovators of show choir. I think the groups that imitate them should take a step up and try and be innovative themselves. Be different!
I like to think that CA groups do well in the Midwest because they are being rewarded for their innovative style![/quote]
I totally agree... and obviously groups like Clinton, Mt. Zion, Fairfield and Marysville are huge innovators too. That's why these schools are the forces of show choir... not because they're from a specific location or have a certain style.
I think the common denominator in all of these groups is that they're continually pushing the envelope and trying new things. Whether it's a more theatrical style or not isn't really what's having the impact, I don't think. It's about doing varied and expressive music we haven't heard a million times before - whether it's a classical piece or a heavy metal song - and then performing the heck out of it. You just can't come out and do "I Drove All Night" or "The Pretender" and not have it instantly compared to Clinton or Burroughs. And while you're learning that, they're already on to the next great idea they've come up with. That's why the online reaction to the group that did "I Want It All Back" seemed tepid even though they performed it well... it was a near carbon copy of Waubonsie Valley's performance from 2008.
I'm also not saying that just doing any random pop song always trumps a traditional classic. There are good catalogue songs out there, no question. It's just about incorporating the music into a show choir set in an appropriate way. The reason I have less a problem with Los Al and Burbank's shows teetering on the verge of musical theater territory than some others is because they didn't just pick up a copy of "Les Mis" or "Rent" and make a condensed show choir version out of it... these are completely original concepts with brilliantly creative uses of pop culture and relevant music woven into their stories. For that, I give them tremendous credit.
There's no rule that says you can't reuse other people's stuff or even that there's anything inherently wrong with it, but I'm just saying those who are leading the pack these days are doing their own thing regardless of if they're from Cali, the South, or the Midwest.
[quote name='Patrickmon' date='1302531246' post='523928']What's Los Al's song set this year? I know the theme is Harry Potter. I didn't get to see them because we went after them in daytime and finals [/quote]
I'm doing this from memory so I know I'll forget something, but they do "New Divide" from Linkin Park, the Hogwarts School Song from Harry Potter, "What Is This Feeling" from Wicked, "To The Sky" by Owl City, "We Will Rock You" by Queen, "In From The Dark" by Silent Force with a bit from "Uprising" by Muse (is this a Josh Greene arrangement?), "Dream On" by Aerosmith, and "Take My Hand" by Simple Plan.
I disagree with Los Al getting Best Vocals over Clover Hill. I think Los Al definitely should have won as they had the best show, but Clover Hill sang so much better and had a better vocal base than Los Al.
I agree that you do see schools model themselves after the few CA show choirs that we have seen live (i.e. Burbank, Burroughs, Hart, Los Al) but think of how all the choirs that have copied Clinton, Mt. Zion, Fairfield, and Marysville. The reason why people imitate them is because they are innovators of show choir. I think the groups that imitate them should take a step up and try and be innovative themselves. Be different!
I like to think that CA groups do well in the Midwest because they are being rewarded for their innovative style!
[quote name='juliofrommississippi' date='1302482604' post='523871']I'm not saying that the results here were wrong, I just thought it was a little lame to have all the Cali groups sweep, when there were many other groups that also did a fantastic job, and deserved at least to take a caption or two from the cali groups.[/quote]
I think the judges just score the shows the way they feel they should be scored, and don't look at the results after the fact and see how they can change them around to make more people happy.
[quote name='juliofrommississippi' date='1302496676' post='523911']
No I didn't mean it like that. You should only get a caption if you deserve it. That being said, I feel like groups get higher praise simply because they are from California. Obviously you will think differently since you were from Cali, but I don't think anyone that watched all day or was at that competition thinks every Cali group deserved to sweep. It just seems like the show choir I fell in love with is gone. Now you have to be edgy and have a theme, and scream in your chest voice in order to do well.[/quote]
Please don't assume that I only like California choirs and think one way because I'm from California. I went to high school in Northern California, where show choir is, in my opinion, much more similar in style to show choirs in the Midwest than it is to show choirs from Southern California. If you don't believe me, check out Enterprise "Starship" when they compete at FAME Nationals.
My pedigree aside... let's just agree to disagree. I'll just end my dialogue by saying that I don't call certain show choirs my favorites because of where they're from, but because of how they perform.
yeah I'm kinda on the same boat with you Julio. I fully understand that what California does as far as show choir is great! Don't change anything and keep doing what you do! But California typish show choir is what seems to be what judges are looking for now. Which is breeding immitators which kinda makes show choir boring which is the reason I don't die everytime I see a Cali choir. This is NO WAY reflects an attitude about how Marysville placed! Marysville performed wonderfully and if third is what they got then third is what they got. Congrats to all groups!!!
[quote name='juliofrommississippi' date='1302496676' post='523911']
Now you have to be edgy and have a theme, and scream in your chest voice in order to do well.[/quote]
Yeah, you used to just have to scream in your head voice....
[quote name='Odrin' date='1302493666' post='523899']
Maybe you misrepresented what you meant by the way you worded it, but it seems like you think other groups should have won something just because they're not from California, i.e. "Choir A also did a fantastic job, AND they're not from California! They should get first place." I mean... really? Captions and awards aren't meant to be distributed equally. It sounds like a crazy idea, but if Bonita Vista and Los Alamitos took first place with BV and BC, maybe it's because they deserved it.[/quote]
No I didn't mean it like that. You should only get a caption if you deserve it. That being said, I feel like groups get higher praise simply because they are from California. Obviously you will think differently since you were from Cali, but I don't think anyone that watched all day or was at that competition thinks every Cali group deserved to sweep. It just seems like the show choir I fell in love with is gone. Now you have to be edgy and have a theme, and scream in your chest voice in order to do well.
[quote name='tscott' date='1302494214' post='523903']Mr. Chavis and company wasn't begged to put on a competition, they sought participants; and when so much is so publicly promised and charged for, but not delivered - not just explanation, but possibly retribution is in order. If, as has been intimated, there was theft of funds, is there a police investigation? Is there a warrant out for someone's arrest?
No one has said yet, but did any choir get the prize money that was promised? Did any of the workshops take place; any of the social events?
And in defense of Mr. Lopez, he could only do what was asked of him. What kind of information and prep did he get ahead of time? Was there someone from the organization with him making sure he had proper pronunciations? Background information? You don't hire a name like that and expect them to know anything; you've only paid for their name, likeness and time. They have to be produced.[/quote]
Before anyone criticizes Antwon, maybe you should find out all the facts because all of the things that went wrong with the competition were in no way his fault. With what he had, he put on a hell of a show and I am truly appreciative that I could come to such an event.
With that being said, no matter what you thought of the competition, I ask that you please do not blame Antwon because if you don't have all the facts then you have absolutely no room to judge.
I am one of the directors who brought my groups to Finale. It needs to be made clear that any director who is considering doing Finale in the in the future DO NOT CONSIDER IT. Here is a list of things that were wrong with this joke of a competition:
1) Radio City was the advertised venue, this was changed without contacting directors! Most directors found out by rumor that turned into truth, some directors found out from other students in other groups.
2) We were originally given a Broadway show to go see. Our group was given different tickets to a completely different show! This happened the night we arrived. Were we notified of the change? NO! I had built up the advertised show and kids were very excited to see it but again this was changed about two hours before we were leaving for the show!
3) In the package THAT MY KIDS AND PARENTS PAID FOR we were to have a dinner at a popular NY restaraunt. We were notified that because of $ mismanagement/embezzelment in the company they did not have the funds to pay for our dinner, THE ONE WE PAID FOR. The major problem with this is I now know that one group got their dinner, who is their choreographer? Antwon/the CEO and founder of Finale! Yes this is true. AS AWFUL AS IT SOUNDS.
4) When we arrived at the hotel we got no welcome packet of any kind.
5) After competition I received no score sheets or score composite nor was I given any instructions on how to obtain them! We left with nothing in regards to scores.
6) There were supposed to be shuttles (provided by Finale) running from our hotel to the venue, whenever we asked about this we were never given a for sure answer by Finale. It was always "we are
working on that". THEY WERE PROMISED FROM day one when the venue got changed. This caused major issues because most of group buses were not to be used and staying in Jersey. This was a huge problem. We ended having to use our own bus as a shuttle for our group and are being rebilled by our bus company. More $ for us!
7) The workshops ended up being ok at best, there was no sign up sheet, no organization to it. The music for the hip hop class was being payed on a tiny mp3 stereo and you could barely hear the music. Over half the classes originally advertised DID NOT EVEN OCCUR.
8) The prize money promised....what do you think?
9) My parents who bought those expensive tickets to come watch were not even asked for their ticket at the door! Could have just walked right in!
Now lets see if Antwon and his company reimburse any of these schools for money that they paid. If he does he will regain some credibility and respect but as of now he has zero of that from me and I assume most directors there this weekend. He did do a nice job salvaging the event after the alleged $ theft. He could have cancelled the event and completely robbed us. For that, good job Antwon. But evrything else was run very poorly. Let me rephrase that, about as poorly as possible.
Again (attention all directors), DO NOT CONSIDER FINALE in the future. It is rollacoaster you do not want to ride. You other directors know this, when the company you are dealing with is unorgainized who does it come back to? YOU! Antwon put me in an awful position with all my students, chaperones, and parent that paid almost $700!
Mr. Chavis and company wasn't begged to put on a competition, they sought participants; and when so much is so publicly promised and charged for, but not delivered - not just explanation, but possibly retribution is in order. If, as has been intimated, there was theft of funds, is there a police investigation? Is there a warrant out for someone's arrest?
No one has said yet, but did any choir get the prize money that was promised? Did any of the workshops take place; any of the social events?
And in defense of Mr. Lopez, he could only do what was asked of him. What kind of information and prep did he get ahead of time? Was there someone from the organization with him making sure he had proper pronunciations? Background information? You don't hire a name like that and expect them to know anything; you've only paid for their name, likeness and time. They have to be produced.
[quote name='juliofrommississippi' date='1302482604' post='523871']
I'm not saying that the results here were wrong, I just thought it was a little lame to have all the Cali groups sweep, when there were many other groups that also did a fantastic job, and deserved at least to take a caption or two from the cali groups.[/quote]
Maybe you misrepresented what you meant by the way you worded it, but it seems like you think other groups should have won something just because they're not from California, i.e. "Choir A also did a fantastic job, AND they're not from California! They should get first place." I mean... really? Captions and awards aren't meant to be distributed equally. It sounds like a crazy idea, but if Bonita Vista and Los Alamitos took first place with BV and BC, maybe it's because they deserved it.
i dont post here too often but i feel this needs to be said......We owe Antwon and all the minds behind this for making this competition so much fun they truly impressed me with all the hard work and focus... and sure things didnt go as planned but hey thats life and you have to work with what you have got.....Antwon and his group did just that....i look forward to finale's future
and good luck to all the choirs in the future
I would like to thank Antwon for all that he did in making this competition possible and known to my show choir. I know it has been a really tough ride for him, and I want him to know how much I appreciate all that he did. The competition was so much fun and I had a blast being in NYC!
Finale Nationals 2011
[/quote]
"Dream On" by Aerosmith, and "Take My Hand" by Simple Plan.
I'll just end my dialogue by saying that I don't call certain show choirs my favorites because of where they're from, but because of how they perform.
