Some schools choose to go to other competitions that happen to be the same weekend. I know Zionsville was at Heart of America Orlando, but I'm not sure about Carmel or CG.
ISSMA state always has issues and over the 17 or so years it hasn’t been worth it. Zionsville and CG to my memory have never attended. Next year there will be a compete ring state contest not tied to issma. The issma sheet needs to be changed and the board is unwilling.
Thanks for the insight. Overheard others in the hall talking about the draw and politics associated with that process. They all work similarly hard, every group is so talented. Indiana schools have some of the best music programs in the country. I try to support them whenever I can.
i wasnt all that impressed with FC -- was not as memorable as some of the others and didnt have a strong story to follow like NC, Fishers and Avon did...
I will say that I do think it's a bit disingenuous to compete at one of multiple HOA competitions, often where there's only 2-3 other choirs competing (especially in the Single Gender division) and then call yourself a "National Champion". I get it, it's a fun competition with some amazing choirs, but I always have an eyeroll at the National Champion talk.
Yeah, it'd be cool to have all the HOA winners come together for one big final competition. But the logistics of that would probably be a nightmare. You'd have to deal with different school calendars for multiple states. And add the fact that most of the California schools start their comp seasons later than the midwest.
Just to make a comment on the regional -> national tournament concept in general, it seems to just not work that well in the world of show choir. It's expensive for many groups to travel (especially if they have to do it multiple times), schedules don't seem to line up for groups across the country, and there has been some resistance in the past for large groups to sign up for mega-events where even great groups can place 10th.
I feel like high school sports teams, cheerleading squads, and marching bands have all figured out how to make it work... so there is really no reason that show choir can't. However, those things all have central governing bodies with bylaws and regulations, and that comes with its own share of issues. Show choir is SUCH a creative and artistic endeavor that the moment we start putting it in a box, I fear we start to kill the essence of what makes it so wonderful.
I would love to see some kind of system where the best of the best can all be together once a year, if only for my own selfish interest in watching a ton of great show choir. But as has been pointed out, even the most well-structured plans really only lasted a few years (and even then, it wasn't like 100% of the country's "best" groups ever competed on the same stage together). It just doesn't exist right now. Maybe another movement will happen in the decades to come and we'll see something like that... but I think many programs are still rebuilding from pandemic losses. Never say never, though!
They charge an arm and a leg to compete. They were always primarily a seller of travel services.
That’s why my choir didn’t go to FAME Nationals in 2017. My director said that while the invite was cool, you had to buy into so much other stuff besides the competition that it wasn’t worth it.
I think it's insane how much FAME Nationals costs. I know since Bloomington Kennedy got an invite this year, they were told they would need $60,000 just to go to the one competition, with ONE group after an entire season of competing. It absolutely blows my mind.
Apparently there is a black cloud over ISSMA. It's being widely reported that a judge deliberately lowered the 5x Grand Champion Roncalli (small group mixed division) scores so much that it was noticed by another judge and effectively reported. The end result cost Roncalli their 6th Championship and a state title. So far there has been no action taken that we know of on this matter. They are probably trying to sweep this under the rug and move past it. As for large groups and the complains of Center Grove and Carmel not competing... after hearing about this, I don't blame them for not competing at this competition. This is a disgrace to the show choir community! ISSMA should try to practice ethical standards that they preach in their Bylaws.
I just assumed CG doesn't participate in ISSMA State Finals because there's no way they'd get their risers set and removed in the strict allotted timeframe.
In the history of issma state, Center grove has never competed. They have a comp with their own score sheet. That’s vastly diff from the issma sheet. Carmel has state championships they don’t go every year. I think Only NC has gone every year since 2005
The same brownsburg that has 1 gc this season? A force? There must be different definitions of that. They do not sing better than FC or fishers or Carmel or CG even in the absence of Carmel and CG they still don’t sing better than Avon fishers or Plainfield. They are a group with great potential that can’t beat the top groups in the state.
A group can still be "a force" even with one GC. I saw them in person and loved their show! Yeah, they might not be as strong as other choirs to some judges and yourself, but maybe to other judges and fans, they are. Everyone has different opinions!!!!! Especially judges!!!!!! (go check out on my recent forum post!! I did a review on them, as well as many other groups that I loved!!)
Listen bae, just go watch their show. Show choir is fun. Not to be argued about. Brownsburg has an outstanding show and they put just as much effort into their show as the other choirs that might score higher than them. It’s just the judges opinions.
Yeesh! Let Brownsburg get a little love & positive attention just for a minute. We all know who the faves in the Indiana Show Choir community are. Still, all of the choirs work hard and perform with heart and energy and they all deserve accolades. Plus, I love an underdog! Aside from that, Brownsburg’s mixed show was refreshingly unique. I loved the raw emotion of it. It had more substance than some of the other shows which I appreciate. But, hey, that’s just my opinion.
Indiana State Large School Finals 2023
