i agree that there are times when pike moves to a position, and then simply dances in that block for a short period of time before moving to another position. while watching the finals video from BD, i noticed that FC uses the "damon" staging and they move around a lot. BUT that doesnt mean that pikes choreography is easy just because they dance in certain blocks. and just because they dont move around in those blocks doesnt mean they dont have footwork. theyre intricate footwork is just done in their block position.
scott, i dont remember if it was a post on here, or if it was in our conversation through IM, but i remember you saying that the only thing pike does "is perform the heck out of their show." as i recall, this IS show choir, lol. and as you said, they may have a "boring" set (your opinion,) but they DO perform the crap out of it, & i think the judges recognize that and that could be a reason why they have done so well.
state will DEFINITELY be interesting. i think especially pike and FC will come out clawing, lol. like ive said before, i personally had FC first at BD, but was incredibly proud of my group. i havent seen NC or HN since BD, but theyve both made changes. im gonna go out on a limb here, and here are my top 5...
GC: Franklin Central (Vocals)
1RU: Pike (Visuals)
2RU: Lawrence Central
3RU: North Central
4RU: Huntington North
I definitely agree! I know i've been tough on Pike! it's only because i have a lot of respect for their program... Every year they have tried something completely new, and until this year i've been entertained by them more than any choir in indy. Granted pike may have not had the best vocals or the cleanest choreo in years past, but they'd been developing a style of their own that i started to see as a kind of altered and improved version of Sauk Prarie's show style, that i thought was pretty refreshing for Indiana choirs...
I DO think pike performs the crap out of their show... And i said that both in an IM convo with you soccerrrr24 and on here. With the numbers they have and the show their directors/choreographers have designed, they are doing REALLY well with it. I NEVER meant to imply otherwise...
All i have ever questioned from the beginning is the TECHNICAL DIFFICULTY of the shows, and how much impact that should have on the judging procedure, given the categories on the issma scoresheet.
i agree that there are times when pike moves to a position, and then simply dances in that block for a short period of time before moving to another position. while watching the finals video from BD, i noticed that FC uses the "damon" staging and they move around a lot. BUT that doesnt mean that pikes choreography is easy just because they dance in certain blocks. and just because they dont move around in those blocks doesnt mean they dont have footwork. theyre intricate footwork is just done in their block position.
scott, i dont remember if it was a post on here, or if it was in our conversation through IM, but i remember you saying that the only thing pike does "is perform the heck out of their show." as i recall, this IS show choir, lol. and as you said, they may have a "boring" set (your opinion,) but they DO perform the crap out of it, & i think the judges recognize that and that could be a reason why they have done so well.
state will DEFINITELY be interesting. i think especially pike and FC will come out clawing, lol. like ive said before, i personally had FC first at BD, but was incredibly proud of my group. i havent seen NC or HN since BD, but theyve both made changes. im gonna go out on a limb here, and here are my top 5...
GC: Franklin Central (Vocals)
1RU: Pike (Visuals)
2RU: Lawrence Central
3RU: North Central
4RU: Huntington North
ahhhh this is sooo cool!!! it makes sense, i mean since there are nine choirs in each class instead of 12 in one, there's actually time and reason to have a "finals"!!! whoo!!! we've done predictions for who makes it to state, but any for top three???
You are misinformed! Both ISSMA sites will take the top 3 placements from prelims into finals competition in both mixed and Single-Gender division.
Really? Wow. It hasn't been like that for the past couple years. My bad. I guess since they're going into small and large schools they are changing some other things around too.
will the Single-Gender finals take place after the mixed day time like regular comps, or will it be Single-Gender prelims followed by Single-Gender finals followed by mixed prelims followed by mixed finals?
He/she was correct for all previous state ISSMA, there were no finals. Along with the addition of classes, it is my understanding the ISSMA contest format has been modified to add an evening finals this year.
You are misinformed! Both ISSMA sites will take the top 3 placements from prelims into finals competition in both mixed and Single-Gender division.
He/she was correct for all previous state ISSMA, there were no finals. Along with the addition of classes, it is my understanding the ISSMA contest format has been modified to add an evening finals this year.
Oh, well in that case thank you, it's very rare... lol
I'm just saying, AS MUCH AS I LOOOVE FC... I groaned and complained when they did "A New World" and "Feeling Good" as their first 2 numbers last year. (even though they WERE undefeated until state)
And when it comes to their closer, of course nobody's done "Shawty get loose", but the only reason ANYONE has started doing hip hop in show choir is because NC (who happens to win a lot) did it first in indiana and rocked the house...
and Shawty Get Loose probably shouldn't be a show choir number in my opinion...
oh geez ease off scott...pike isnt perfect...i love them, but they arent perfect. some voice parts are much much louder than others and, even live, sometimes you cant hear a certain voice part at all. Also, saying that "99%" of their show is in 4+ parts is incorrect...85-90% maybe. and can we please leave pikes vocals alone? they know they have work to do, and i trust mr. stainbrook enough to say that im positive that hes been working vocals the past two weeks. i fully expect for them to come out both this weekend and next as a completely different group. one thing ive learned from being in encores is that they know how to work hard...give them the time and they can surprise you...
You of all people know that it is NOT the performance of the students i have issue with... The SHOW pike has, is just not great...
JFreak never comments on any thread on here unless it's relevant to pike.. And never complains when i criticize other groups, only pike...
Pike's show is performed well... But i'm sorry, it is my opinion that the show lacks the technical difficulty to be an "Awesome Show"... It is filled with numbers we've seen over and over, and arrangements we've heard before... I'm pretty sure that pike's arrangement of "Column" is the same that has gone around through damon choirs in years before (when damon choreographed for pike) I'm not 100% but it sounded pretty close...
Pike's kids are making the most of the show they've been given, and for that they deserve applause. I do feel though that if they had a different set, with the vocals and cleanliness of the choreography they seem to be able to acheive, they could actually be a powerhouse in indiana... Not just pretend to be by using the numbers all directors know will score well...
There are no finals for ISSMA state. All choirs perform, then are placed accordingly. The shore sheet is scored 60% vocal and 40% visual. Hope that helps!!
You are misinformed! Both ISSMA sites will take the top 3 placements from prelims into finals competition in both mixed and Single-Gender division.
oh geez ease off scott...pike isnt perfect...i love them, but they arent perfect. some voice parts are much much louder than others and, even live, sometimes you cant hear a certain voice part at all. Also, saying that "99%" of their show is in 4+ parts is incorrect...85-90% maybe. and can we please leave pikes vocals alone? they know they have work to do, and i trust mr. stainbrook enough to say that im positive that hes been working vocals the past two weeks. i fully expect for them to come out both this weekend and next as a completely different group. one thing ive learned from being in encores is that they know how to work hard...give them the time and they can surprise you...
I liked Pike's show. And I don't think they would have been GC at Ben Davis if they didn't have a good show. It may not have many many different parts of vocal and choreo like other choirs but they are still great. They have been doing a great job this year.
First off, I like to think that normally I stay away from commenting on criticism of groups I like. It doesn't change anyone's mind and just creates animosity. But I felt compelled this time because this guy has been saying this stuff over and over I'm worried that people might start believing him.
I know that in all but 1 number during pike's show, the footwork is nearly elementary... They NEVER sing in 4 parts unless they're standing still... The blocks hardly move (watch the closer 3 stage positions the entire song and all the men/women doing the same choreo). The combo arrangements are simple and not well played, and when the choir IS moving, they're singing in unison or in 2 parts...
Now Scott, we need to talk. There are a few things that I know for certain. I know that you don't have the arrangement for the Encores' show and I know that you weren't in their choreography sessions. This also means I know that you cannot know any of the things you claim to in this post.
I know that in all but 1 number during pike's show, the footwork is nearly elementary...
Are you sure this isn't just your opinion? Let me answer for you: Yes, it is. That's fine, it's your opinion, whatever. Everyone has one. I mean, certainly I believe differently than you, doesn't make me right either. But, I will add as a caveat that judges this year tend to disagree with you. They also only have opinions, but we all know theirs are more important because they get paid.
They NEVER sing in 4 parts unless they're standing still...
Here's where I start to really have a problem with what you're saying. You're throwing these statements around like they are fact, and they just aren't. This is blatantly false. And I just don't know where the problem is. Maybe it's your ears, maybe the only youtube video up of them is just too poor in quality, maybe you're biased, or maybe you're just being hyperbolic. Whatever it is, it's just flat out wrong. Now, what is actually true about their arrangement is that minus one chorus in the closer where they sing in octaves, the Encores sing in at least four (often more) parts regardless of whether they are moving or not.
The blocks hardly move (watch the closer 3 stage positions the entire song and all the men/women doing the same choreo).
They actually move five times to four different positions (ABACD). Not sure how you got three out of that. And seriously, you can't honestly think that the girls and guys have the same choreography the whole closer, right? Besides four measures at the beginning and four measures right before the a cappella part, they have completely different moves. You might want to take a more critical look next time you watch them.
The combo arrangements are simple and not well played, and when the choir IS moving, they're singing in unison or in 2 parts...
That's your opinion about the combo. So whatever. But now somehow we've gotten back to this point you've made up. I will say it again, this time a little more concise: 99% of the Encores' show is sung in 4+ parts.
Well actually, no i ain't "seen" the wrong show...
Maybe you didn't see the wrong show, but I have to question whether or not the conclusions you drew were based in reality.
Edit: One thing I'd like to add, because I'm not sure if it comes across. I honestly don't care if you like Pike's show. It's not my place to say what's good or bad in your eyes. But I just cannot stand when people make things up to put groups down.
Indiana State Large School Finals 2009
