Boy. This rammar guy swears he is some show choir god or something. Kids..let me tell you..if you really plan on doing anything after high school with music DO NOT bank everything on show choir..we cant all be eden.
I loved show choir when I was in it and i could NEVER turn down a good battle on show choir. com..but..man..sometimes..when youre old..you gotta let it go..its for the kids..not you.
It's very nice that everyone has a place to communicat and that our leaders take the time to explaing so that there is no confusion. I think we all have a tendency to make comments when we don't know all the facts and that just creates a snowball effect. I am excited for all of the coming competitions and clinics. Looking forward to seeing everyone. Thank you.
Lots of good theories here and I'm sure that every director has different reasons for going or not going to this festival or that festival. I think it is important to NOT put words into any director's mouth. I can only speak for Burroughs on this matter....
Rollie is quite correct that the scoresheet is not keeping us away. We have won this festival a number of times and I greatly respect the adjudicators that they use at this festival annually. I like the fact that there are different score sheets (and thus different results) in our circuit. It is a challenge that, in the end, makes us a better choir. If we can place well at festivals with 70/30 splits and others with 50/50 splits...we are doing a lot of things right.
The biggest factor for me deciding to alter our schedule this year is preparation time and the stopping points within that time (ie: performances). It is no secret that the Powerhouse show evolves throughout the year. We never start with the same show that we end up with. While it may seem like poor planning and/or lack of prepration....it is intentional and we like this method. We do try to reach a "stopping point" for each performance. This means that for every competition we have a solid version of our show that is as prepared as we can possibly make it. The problem is that at the beginning of the season, one week inbetween competitions is not long enough to make the kind of changes and improvements that we would like to make. For many years we have opened the season at the end of January and competed for three straight weekends before taking a few weekends off to do Pop Show. By the time we hit march we are ready to compete every weekend while making increasingly smaller changes to the show, but this is not the case at the beginning of the year.
So, why Aztec Sing then? (as opposed to the others). We are actually only going to one of the three this year (Diamond Bar HS). In addition to not attending Aztec Sing, we are also not attending the competition at Brea Olinda HS. We are not attending Brea mostly due to scheduling conflicts. It is the day after the Diamond Bar Competition and the same day as the women's competition down at Bonita Vista HS. Aztec and Diamond Bar have lots in common. Similar scoresheets, several of the same adjudicators, same venue. The reason that I like the Diamond Bar Competition better is that it is hosted by a school that is fully participating in our show choir circuit and comes with the kind of team spirit that we have developed in Southern California. We share risers, the crews help each other and there isn't a nervous climate. Everyone is afraid of the rules at Aztec Sing and how they are enforced. There is nothing wrong with that necessarily, but since I can come back and get all the positives a few weeks later, I can solve my problems and avoid a few negatives by simply not going.
I would like to point out that its not a "mass boycott" or anything like that. The only schools that attended last year that I know aren't going this year are Burroughs and Burbank.
I would also like to point out that Burbank's festival is a FAR different event than any of our normal competitions in addition to being the day following Aztec. As a non-competitive, clinic-driven event...I feel that it will be good for my choirs who will definitely have lots to improve upon at that point.
I'm very excited to see what everyone has in store for this year!
Don't make comments about something of which you know nothing about. Aztec Sing is the oldest running show choir competition in California and the second oldest in the country. The score sheet has remained basically the same for over 35 years. It is presently 73% Music and 27% Show. There are three other competitions in California that are 70% Music and 30% Show and they are very well attended by all of the top groups. The reason for some groups not attending Aztec Sing this year probably has more to do with the date of the event than the scoresheet. To suggest otherwise is insulting to the groups not attending. You are suggesting that if a group does not sing well, why attend a festival that emphasizes vocals? Burroughs and Burbank have both won Aztec Sing and they are very showy groups. Arcadia has won competitions that emphasize more aspects of the show, and no one would accuse them of being one of the "showier" groups.
It's an early competition and those of us who choreograph Christmas shows have about three weeks max to put together a competition set. It's a struggle for my group and we don't have elaborate sets and costumes. Maybe some directors feel as if there isn't enough time to do justice to their set and group. I don't think it is the score sheet that scares directors and their groups off.
Rollie Maxson
Arcadia
thank you for the reminder that this is an open forum, tscott. to respond to the criticisms leveled at my post, i will clarify point by point.
"Aztec Sing is the oldest running show choir competition in California and the second oldest in the country. The score sheet has remained basically the same for over 35 years."
i believe this admission, if anything, adds validity to what i posted earlier. show choir as an activity and educational tool has changed and progressed over the years. to think that the same scoresheet which presumably judged choirs fairly 35 years ago could still be the best scoresheet to use today is quite ridiculous. in 35 years time, the repertoire choirs perform and the way they perform it has changed significantly, the means by which we judge choirs should change to correspond with the evolution of competing groups. otherwise, competition results really would not be an indication of a group's quality.
"It is presently 73% Music and 27% Show. There are three other competitions in California that are 70% Music and 30% Show and they are very well attended by all of the top groups."
so it appears i was correct in posting that the Aztec Sing scoresheet does not correspond with the prevalent 60/40 divide. i never compared the scoresheet specifically to those of other Californian competitions, so i feel your point is somewhat irrelevant. even if three other Californian competitions do judge with a 70/30 split, i feel it is much more productive to look at show choir nationally. after all, is the West Coast looking to isolate itself in competition? i would think not, and participation in national competitions by Californian choirs would indicate the same. instead of creating one standard in California and another widely used throughout the country, does it not make more sense to move toward national standardization?
"You are suggesting that if a group does not sing well, why attend a festival that emphasizes vocals? Burroughs and Burbank have both won Aztec Sing and they are very showy groups. Arcadia has won competitions that emphasize more aspects of the show, and no one would accuse them of being one of the "showier" groups."
i am not suggesting that poor vocal groups are avoiding Aztec Sing. i agree that both John Burroughs and Burbank are "showy groups," but i also think they are very technically proficient and can sing better than most groups in the country. certainly they wouldn't avoid Aztec Sing to disguise poor vocals, but perhaps they wouldn't attend so that they aren't judged by a scoresheet which does not reflect all of the merits of their shows. why bother to construct and perform sets showcasing excellent choreography and show design if it is not going to be acknowledged or considered?
"It's an early competition and those of us who choreograph Christmas shows have about three weeks max to put together a competition set. It's a struggle for my group and we don't have elaborate sets and costumes. Maybe some directors feel as if there isn't enough time to do justice to their set and group."
i certainly respect the role time constraints play in allowing groups to prepare for competition, i was involved in a competitive show choir after all, but i fail to see how this would be a larger factor in determining a group's participation than in past years. last season Aztec Sing took place on January 26, 2007, this season it will be held on January 25, 2008. what has changed in that period of time that would cause a number of groups to decide that they simply can not perform early in the season?
It's an open forum. Make all the comments you want, shoegazer.
You are pretty spot on. And as more events are added to replace them, I would look for other 73/27 competitions to have fewer groups attending as well.
it is my understanding that many choirs are choosing to not attend and compete at Aztec Sing because of the competition's relatively outdated scoresheet. i have heard it does not weigh vocals and choreography on a scale similar to many other scoresheets (vocals 60%/choreo 40%), and it does not include scored captions for show design and important aspects of choreography, such as appropriateness of style.
Don't make comments about something of which you know nothing about. Aztec Sing is the oldest running show choir competition in California and the second oldest in the country. The score sheet has remained basically the same for over 35 years. It is presently 73% Music and 27% Show. There are three other competitions in California that are 70% Music and 30% Show and they are very well attended by all of the top groups. The reason for some groups not attending Aztec Sing this year probably has more to do with the date of the event than the scoresheet. To suggest otherwise is insulting to the groups not attending. You are suggesting that if a group does not sing well, why attend a festival that emphasizes vocals? Burroughs and Burbank have both won Aztec Sing and they are very showy groups. Arcadia has won competitions that emphasize more aspects of the show, and no one would accuse them of being one of the "showier" groups.
It's an early competition and those of us who choreograph Christmas shows have about three weeks max to put together a competition set. It's a struggle for my group and we don't have elaborate sets and costumes. Maybe some directors feel as if there isn't enough time to do justice to their set and group. I don't think it is the score sheet that scares directors and their groups off.
it is my understanding that many choirs are choosing to not attend and compete at Aztec Sing because of the competition's relatively outdated scoresheet. i have heard it does not weigh vocals and choreography on a scale similar to many other scoresheets (vocals 60%/choreo 40%), and it does not include scored captions for show design and important aspects of choreography, such as appropriateness of style.
I wasnt saying that I wont enjoy it. I cant wait to see the other choirs.
I just know more people from those choirs.
But I have friends and Family in other choirs and I think its going to be great!
Plenty of good groups are going. And speaking for my group, Brea is very excited about it.
I think sometimes too much emphasis is put on one group or another, and many fine show choirs are overlooked or discounted. The Aztec Sing will be just as exciting as it ever is for those of us going. Good luck to all of the groups participating. Dave Willert
Hey I know everyone is excited for yet another start of the competition season. So who is going this year and where can I find information to get tickets to this. Some one please help me out but take care and can't wait for it.
Burroughs, Burbank, Hart, and Chula are definitely not going.
Hey I know everyone is excited for yet another start of the competition season. So who is going this year and where can I find information to get tickets to this. Some one please help me out but take care and can't wait for it.
Azusa Aztec Sing XXXIII 2008
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Plenty of good groups are going. And speaking for my group, Brea is very excited about it.