I believe he DID say Momentum should have beaten Findlay.
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no I said I didn't think we would, but I didn't say we wouldn't. I was bored sick with there show...maybe it was because CR Jeff had almost the same exact show a year ago and they didn't do it was well as JEff in my opinion, either way I did think especially MTZ would beat them. Also if you weren't at the comp, than you shouldn't be suprised to see opinions on what people saw. If you didn't see the groups at the competition than don't be so suprised to hear an opinion maybe you don't agree with. I personally wasn't impressed by Findlay, or how the scoring was done at this competition, and lastt ime I checked...I was able to say that. Also, I wasn't even really aware of when we beat findlay last, or when it was...2001 apparently was the last time we competed against them...so great we beat them. If anmyone is suggesting I'm basing my opinioon upon 2 entirely different shows of which neither I was a part of, than your wrong. I thought MTZ was better than Findlay, and YES dare I say, after talking to MTZ moms and dads who said they thought we were going to win, and after seeing the "best vocal moment I've seen this whole year" comment on our score card, I thoughgt we were a front runner as well. i already said Findlay is a great choir, and I love them to death...it's nothing personal. I just wasn't nnear as wowed by then as I was with MTZ. End of discussion.
I AM SO HAPPY FINDLAY WON.....MAN I AM SO EXCITED I CANT EXPLAIN I HAVE BEEN WANTING MTZ TO LOOSE TO SOMEONE THIS YEAR TO BREAK THEIR LUCKY STREAK (I KNOW THATS HORRIBLE TO SAY)....BUT YAY FINDLAY!!!!!!!!
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lucky streak? 6 grand champs is a whole lot of luck
ALL I KNOW IS, i think momentums show was the best preformance we have ever done, and so if it deserved 4th then we got 4th. im not about ready to sit here and make excuses becuz our show was amazing for us! and i think we are all proud of how we did that day!!!!
You know what, I am absolutly sick of the ridiculous things high schoolers have to say about Findlay. What really amazes me is that Mt. Zion won best vocals over Findlay. Findlay's sound is so mature, so amazing. Their vocals are out of this world. Perhaps certain people who happen to be complaining about their victory simply cannot understand their greatness becuase they are far too sophisticated for most high schoolers to understand.
What really perturbs me most is the ridiculous arguments made by a certain Washington member. To sugest that Findlay is not even a powerhouse? That you should have beat them? Preposterous! I can understand that you're upset about not getting placed, even though you got fourth. That is slightly ridiculous, but it still does not justify the incredibly ridiculous things that you are saying about Findlay. Additionally, you are judging them based on another group, just because they have the same choreographer! Do you know how many groups April James choreographs? Yet no one judges Clinton based on other April groups!
I've never seen Washington, but just because you beat them in 2001 does not mean you should beat them now! Your claims are absolutly ridiculous. Please stop the whining and bitterness.
The whole general effect thing..... Half is music, half is visual. It's just an extension of the other visual and vocal criterias. Calling it general effect isn't quite accurate. It's just more judges to even out the scores.
well, Jon T...I gave MY opinion, along with about 100 other people who feel the same way I do lol. I think even some Findlay people were stunned. I have nothing against Findlay, and I met some really nice people from there. They 're a VERY hard working and talented group don't get me wrong. However, I personally didn't watch them and think power house, or watch them and feel threatened (like I do when I compete against good groups). Findlay had ONE judge give them a very inflated score in "over all effect," most of the other judges had us in 2nd, or 3rd, and MTZ in 1st. If you saw both of the groups perform, like I did...there is NO way you can say MTZ wasn't as good choreographically or vocally...the General effect thing in my opinion is just so judges can give high marks to shows or show styles they liked. FIndlay was VERY classic, noone else really was, except MTZ, for some of there show. I think it's unfai a group can win based on subjective behaviour like that instead of the actual criteria that makes a show choir good, regardless of style. It was bull....no arguments can be made that the competition's score card is ridiculous.... it makes me wana vomit on the keynote people .
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Well, I didn’t mean to bash your opinion but Findlay is more than deserving of the win. It isn’t like they have never won against Mt. Zion before. I don’t usually even like watching Findlay and I thought their show this year was the best show choir show I had seen. Although I have seen Mt. Zion in the past, I have only seen part of their show this year. That was when their show was broadcasted over the internet at Mundelein. So, I can’t compare the two until I finally get the DVDs I ordered. However, I will say that Findlay is the definition of a powerhouse.
When I think of FFE I think of substance and not style. So, this whole argument that Findlay won because of their style isn’t quite computing in my mind. Maybe they did but I still find that argument very odd.
Oh yeah! Findlay just did not deserve that win at all!
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well, Jon T...I gave MY opinion, along with about 100 other people who feel the same way I do lol. I think even some Findlay people were stunned. I have nothing against Findlay, and I met some really nice people from there. They 're a VERY hard working and talented group don't get me wrong. However, I personally didn't watch them and think power house, or watch them and feel threatened (like I do when I compete against good groups). Findlay had ONE judge give them a very inflated score in "over all effect," most of the other judges had us in 2nd, or 3rd, and MTZ in 1st. If you saw both of the groups perform, like I did...there is NO way you can say MTZ wasn't as good choreographically or vocally...the General effect thing in my opinion is just so judges can give high marks to shows or show styles they liked. FIndlay was VERY classic, noone else really was, except MTZ, for some of there show. I think it's unfai a group can win based on subjective behaviour like that instead of the actual criteria that makes a show choir good, regardless of style. It was bull....no arguments can be made that the competition's score card is ridiculous.... it makes me wana vomit on the keynote people .
we heard people say this: "why dont they just go back to iowa and eat corn"
You know what - just be thankful that they at least got that part right. They could have been saying 'go back and eat potatos' - that's happened to me before!
Dr. Peter Eklund (General Effect Music) (U of Nebraska Faculty)
Dr. Russell Robinson (General Effect Music) (U of Florida Faculty, Warner Bros Publ arranger)
Marty DeMott (General Effect Visual) (Ball State U Faculty, SCA staff)
Lawrence Fitz (General Effect Visual) (Founder- Celebration Entertainment Academy in CA)
The Soloist judges were:
Cheri Coons (Singer/ songwriter)
Peter Eldridge (Manhattan School of Music faculty)
Phil Reno (Conductor- The Producers, Cats, Chess. Pianist for Dame Edna)
Ha... After all that hard work Showstoppers did this year to revamp their image, and make sure we all knew they were "thinking outside the box"... Who was judging this comp?
Ha... After all that hard work Showstoppers did this year to revamp their image, and make sure we all knew they were "thinking outside the box"... Who was judging this comp?
hey this is jay. i want to say a few things. personally momentum had the most AMAZING show we've ever done and if it can only get us 4th then ok w/e....
findlay should NOT have beaten Mt. Zion. idk what the heck was with that i saw both groups and it should not have gone that way. especially since MTZ won the actual choreo and vocal awards. i just think the whole judging system is screwy. the vocal category only gets 25%??? and the choreo gets only 25% as well??????? that is stupid that the effect categories get 50%.... and all the stupid rules for showstoppers... i felt like i couldnt step out of line at ALL.... i thought they shouldve given trophies to ALL the finalists....
shout out to mt zion. they were the NICEST people. they were so friendly and we got to talk to them. the findlay people were nice too
no shout out to greece athena people.... stop complaining about getting third especially to mt zion and findlay. p.s. since none of our group did ANYTHING to you idk why you would talk crap about us. WE WERE SITTING RIGHT IN FRONT OF YOU!!!!! we heard people say this: "why dont they just go back to iowa and eat corn" i personally dont eat corn. im going out to the irish democrat right now and im gonna get a nice juicy hamburger. those types of comments are stupid and they provide a really bad reputation to their group. probably like this post made me and my group look but i dont care because it was SOOOOO RUDE!!!!!
otherwise I LOVE NEW YORK CITY!!!!!!!!!!!!! and jamba juice
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Man, I couldn't agree more. CR wash was fourth place for the record...so it looked like this:
1: Findlay
2:Mt. Zion (they shoulda won)
3:Greece Athena
4:CR Wash
5: Diamond Bar
anywayz....I had the time of my life in NYC, it was soo much fun, no one even really thougt about the competition until thursday, which to me was a good thing. now, what I'm going to piss and moan about is not related to me being upset about out placing. I respected each group there, and had each individual thing not been judged by itself, I think the placings would've been WAY tighter, cos' every finalist was truly amazing in my opinion:
okay...after sitting in showstoppers, reading the rules, and seeing our scores and how the scoring is arranged....I now understand why no one goes to show stoppers anymore. It's almost to the point where performing there wasn't any fun. All we could worry about was getting the wells set up in time, and the band tuning in time so we don't get a point deduction, all so that the stupid little key note people don't lose a few minutes of their day. And only awarding the top 3 spots? that's bull I might add. We had 2 judges say that our ballad was the best vocal moment of the entire day...we were VERY good, we really were, as was was everone else in the finals. What I'm saying is that just because we didn't make the top three doesn't mean we shouldn't get a fricken placement award. It's the dumbest thing in the world. The entry fees for this competiton are outrageous, and we don't even go home with a trophy, although we made finals and beat some very talented groups. I don't see how anyone who looked at their score cards, or at the rule book, or who spent more than 10 minutes on the 6th or 7th floor of the mariott could say that this was a good competition. I'm not gonna cos a ruckus, and I don't wana start a debate, but my main proof of this crappy score card would be findlay over Mt. Zion by a ridiculous amount. Findlay had a higher "total effect" score, although vocally and choreographically they had higher marks almost unanimously. I saw Findlay (as I did a year ago...oh no wait that was CR Jeff...but you have a "show in a box," so it was identical to theirs lol), and I thought they were good, but I didn't think WE would lose to them let alone Mt. Zion. There is NOOO way that it was legit, just no way. I'm ignoring that it ever happened so there. I have more to say (stuff that judges said about how they were treated, and how stupid the comp was), but I'll refrain. congrats to Findlay, despite my opinion, and I thought every group that I saw in finals was REALLY good, so congrats.
Our Choir participated in Showstoppers Orlando this year. Although Showstoppers provides an amazing setting to perform with great competition, I don't agree on how they do their scoring. Sometimes it is plain obvious when something is wrong. At this competition our finals scores were such a roller coaster. One Judge had us in 6th place and the other judge for the same category had us in 1st. It was like that with all the judges for each category. I find it to be very unprofessional and really think that the corporation who runs this competition should rethink how its done. The way the run the rest of the competition does indeed make up for it though. I tell ya, I don't think you could get enough of Billy Flanagan. This post is just an opinion not me complaining about our palcement. Our goal was to make finals and we got 5th runner up, we had tears of joy. It was outstanding. I personally just don't agree with the judging and current method of scoring. Apparently Im not the only one....
HUGE CONGRADS TO FINDLAY!!!! I knew you all had it!! I cant wait to get my DVD from Teays so I can see your show!! (that is if I ever get it!?!?!?!) Way to represent ohio!!!!
Showstoppers New York City 2005
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